Friday, 6 March 2009

Homosexuality

The preparation of a new campaign against homosexuality (sodomy) is underway on the blogsphere. I'm not sure if it is against homosexuality or just to understand the position of homosexuals in our Arab societies since the person calling for this campaign was not really clear, nevertheless there is something about sodomy and there will be alot of clashes between those who believe that homosexual people have a right to express their sexual orientation in public while in the other corner there are those who believe that homosexuality corrupts society (the later is my position on homosexuality).

Just a quick thought and comparison. The idea of deregulation of markets has been viewed by many as a means of increasing trade and improving the economical aspects of a country. However and without going into details this has not worked out and the current economic downturn for example can only, in my opinion, be dealt with through more stringent regulations on markets and more importantly on the financial sector. Deregulation is based on the assumption that corporations and companies are run by good people that run their businesses under ethical and moral considerations, unfortunately this is not the case and in reality corporations are greedy organizations that want to maximize profits as quick as possible.
In addition to that, regulators underestimated the greediness of some businessmen, their inefficiency and carelessness led to the biggest scams in the history of this market system (that we know of). A good example here is the case of Bernard Madoff.

Now the same goes with society. If we assume that every person is a good person whom live their lives according to high ethical and moral standards we will be fooling ourselves. I am not saying that everyone is bad, but at the same time not everyone is good. The move of societies away from religion and into more secular, liberal societies is due to the affluence of a population in a society. The more affluent a society is the more they have resources and time to fulfill their needs and ‘desires’. People’s needs are instinctive, we need to eat, sleep, psychological needs and so on. However our desires are things we make up. Accordingly sexual orientation is a desire and not a need. A person does not need to have sexual intercourse with another person of the same sex, but because that person has reached a certain level of affluence where all their needs have been fulfilled they turn to their desires, things they make-up in order to quench that desire.

Religion regulates our lives, it reminds us of what is right and what is wrong and what is healthy in a society and what will corrupt society therefore religion maintains the integrity of a society. In most religions, especially in Islam, the society as a whole is always more important than the individual but that does not take away the rights of the individual. When an individual is seen to be practicing something that will lead to a corruption of society they are punished, and the punishment varies today from one Islamic country to another, from being fined to capital punishment as is the case in Iran. However in Islam and the Islamic law, the Sharia’ah, a person accusing someone of homosexuality (or any other crime punishable under Sharia’ah) is not something easy to go on about. In order for a person to be accused of homosexuality there needs to be four witnesses that can bear witness that the person accused has committed sodomy, in the case that one fails to be a legitimate witness all four witnesses are punished.

So to conclude, there is no need for those who like to consider themselves as homosexuals/transsexuals to openly act in a homosexual way in public in a country where the majority of people follow the religion of Islam. If someone does not believe in islam, lives in a muslim country and is homosexual then maybe you should keep it to yourself and practice whatever you practice in your house.

7 comments:

No_Angel said...

just cause i can't ignore any economical drivel ... madoff is a con artist not a corp head, and protectionism fared much worse. either way can't compare economical systems with ideologies, but if you will compare liberal Andalusia under al hakkam II with that of the almohad dynasty and you know a little nice thing about al hakkam ... maybe you should check it out. That was the golden age of islam, a very less myopic one atleast.

Jabi said...

ops.. i left out a whole section in regards to the part about madoff..

Madoff was a con artist and i wasn't linking what he did to the deregulation of markets rather i missed this part out "In addition to that, regulators underestimated the greediness of some businessmen, their inefficiency and carelessness led to the biggest scams in the history of this market system (that we know of). A good example here is the case of Bernard Madoff."

I am not talking about protectionism, because that would not work very well in both cases economical or ideological, people will not accept it and we only need to look at Iran to understand why at the level of society protectionism will not work.

However my comparison was based upon the idea of liberalism, loosening regulations in order to create more wealth. The idea is that we can't have an unregulated or less regulated economy neither can we have an economy that is extensively regulated nevertheless that wasn't the point of my discussion.

My point was to compare and contrast different areas where "liberal" thoughts have lead to dire consequences that were not foreseen by regulators (madoff).

Why can I not compare a system to an ideology?
The system here is not a mechanical one or an electrical one, you can have a liberal economist and a conservative economist just in the same way that you can have a liberal politician or a conservative politician, or the many different schools of thought in a religion.

If Al Hakkam was not homosexual he would have had a son that would have been able to succeed his father. Him being a homosexual lead later on to "dire consequences" with conflicts increasing because of his actions.

No_Angel said...

But he did have a son, Hisham II, and he even had a "wife" called jaffar that beared him that son :D the rule was toppled by isurgency as i recall ...
Either way for the sake of not being side tracked.
Your premise:
Homosexuality if allowed to be expressed in public will corrupt society and make bad things happen.

To prove the invalidity of that premise i took it out of the hypothetical and placed it within historical context in which the ruler was obviously interested in the same sex (not just a commoner but a caliphate) that under his leadership the muslim experienced one of their best periods. If thats a dire consequence then can i have more of those ? the alternative that you are pushing for is exemplified by al mohad, and the consequences were dire.
Anyways al hakam II is hardly the only example of such a ruler with those characteristics so its not an exception, it also suggests the idea that homophobia is an imperialistic foreign element that was adopted because they looked up to the imperialistic culture while it was never prevelant in islamic culture.

Maysaloon said...

No_Angel,
You are making a number of assumptions. Mainly, that the period in question was the Golden age of Islam and secondly, the fact that al Hakam the Second having a predilection for other men is somehow related to that. I would argue that your conclusion does not follow at all from your premise and whilst you give us a valid argument, you are wrong. A valid argument is not always true, it is only valid when it is not possible for the conclusion to be false whilst the premises are true. You ignore the system of government and the already stable country which he had inherited.

I think Jabi is correct in his analogy of the economy and of morality in society, both aim somehow for the good of everyone, yet both can be horribly damaging.

No_Angel said...

while the idea of whether it was the golden or not can be contested, i never claimed that its because he was interested in men that he was a good ruler.
All i Said is that here is a case of a person at the highest level of office in the islamic world, that managed to rule for a considerable period of time and achieved great things.
That was to prove that when homosexuality is expressed in public doesn't corrupt society at all, it's just business as usual.

saint said...

If I want to reflect your article on reality, I would say you are saying that if homosexuality practiced in private in group of four or less it is their business. You are saying that we people are fine from any harm if government used this rule. I think your views are way more liberal in contrast to the religious authority in the Muslim world. It is almost similar to Regan policy of Don’t Ask Don’t Tell policy, which proved it is ineffectiveness. Don’t you think it is better to make things in the open and give individuals the freedom of choice government by roles more strict than the upper one to protect children from pedophiles?

Jabi said...

@ saint...

I think you have misunderstood what i said. In groups of 4 or 1 million it doesn't really matter, I was just explaining the Islamic law of wanting to accuse some one of homosexuality or any other crime punishable under Islamic law.

In short what I believe should be the case in our societies is that:

- homosexual behavior in public should not be exhibited. If intimacy in our countries between a man and a woman is looked down upon and dealt with harshly by the police (give that in Syria there is the moral police) why should homosexual acts be treated differently. I suggest any sexual acts to be banned from being exhibited in public. There is a time an place for that type of stuff, and it is definitely not in the public.

- I don't think we are at any harm, as long as there is still some sense in most people and as long as people raise their children well then the harm of allowing homosexuals to express their sexual orientation in public is minimal.

- my views regarding islam are not liberal, I am just giving advice to those who wish to fulfill their lust and desires of committing sodomy to do it somewhere where no one can see them. I will be going through studying this issue in detail from an Islamic perspective and Islamic law perspective (just like the topic on Apostasy in Islam)

- well its more like "Don't Act, Don't tell" because I don't think that anybody in the street would want to know who someone likes to sleep with, I don't care, no one cares, and don't do it in public.

-people are given the freedom of choice, if they want to be homosexual, then be that, but don't do it in public! This is not stripping away any rights for anyone to determine what they want to be, it is just saying respect the rights of others as well, because I bet you alot of people in Syria would not want to see two men making out in the middle of the street.

- I don't understand what you mean by this "freedom of choice government by roles more strict than the upper one to protect children from pedophiles?"

do you mean that our government have a more important thing to do than to look out for homosexual acts in public? like pedophiles?

well they do have a whole police department working on maintaining morality in public, having that on the list of indecent acts would not make them less efficient.